DIRECT IS KIND, So Stop Trying to be "Nice." Embrace Clarity, Honesty, Transparency and Vulnerability in Relationships

Speaker 1 So, in today's episode, we're going to be talking about how direct is kind. And I share a story of something that happened way early in my career, about 16 years ago, that uh has honestly set me up for the work I'm doing now. And I share the story of an email that I wrote to the VP of sales of my company when he decided to motivate our sales team by taking away our chairs. I'm not going to say any more right now because I'm going to invite you to listen, but I found that email that I had saved. And here is what the exchange was.

Speaker 1 October 29th, 2008. Subject of the email work environment. This is an email I wrote to the VP of Sales. Dear boss, we're going to leave the names out of it. I think I understand your goal in taking away our chairs. However, I have to tell you that I feel this is the most disrespectful and unprofessional work environment that I've ever been in. I cannot speak for anyone else here in the office, but I can say that I've been working my butt off and have reached out to over 35 contacts at 30 companies. And if you want a detailed list, it would be my pleasure to put

Speaker 1 one together for you. With no success yet in capital letters. I have been on the phone all morning and have even moved my whole desk to the floor to make this work. But now this is simply demeaning. I respect you as my manager and VP, but I certainly do not feel that I am respected in any way as an employee as I sit on the floor or stand leaning over my desk. I am all caps about motivation, but I do not find myself motivated or feeling stronger in any way. What we are doing now is preventing me from doing my job. And I think that this

Speaker 1 is the opposite of what it's supposed to be doing. I do not know about anyone else in here, but I know that I'm busy working to help my manager with a lot of very important projects. Getting my chair taken away makes me feel like some sort of child being punished. And I really don't appreciate it. I'm not asking to be praised for my work in any way, but to be disrespected this way is not motivating. If you want to punish people in here who are actually sitting around and not doing their jobs, that's fine. I think I've shown that I'm not one of those people. And

Speaker 1 if I am wrong about this, then please tell me. I would be happy to come up with some ways with which I think we could actually motivate people in the office. Respectfully, Svetlana. And I CC'd my manager. In about 15 minutes, I received an email back. Svetlana, if I need to point out the great many things that you have been afforded from the class A plus workspace you work in, to trips to Sydney and San Diego, lavish corporate events, a promotion in less than a year out of college, and so many more, I certainly can. I'm sorry you found going without a chair for several hours

Speaker 1 that much of a discomfort. In the scheme of things, it was in an effort to show you two things: a sense of urgency and the difference between activity and results. Activity will not make you a success in life. If you lack the perspective to see the whole of your situation, as well as trying to understand the lesson, that is really unfortunate. Your manager will discuss with you further, but I can assure you, I find the insolent and audacious tone of this email every bit as insulting as you found not being able to use your chair. Given what we have recently discussed about future opportunities for you,

Speaker 1 don't you think this makes me wonder about how you will handle any sort of adversity? Please do not email me back. Talk to me in person. And with that, my dear masterful listeners, uh, join me in looking at uh what it means to be direct, how being direct is kind, and yeah, I'll let you know what unfolded here after this very interesting and quite life-altering moment that I had in my first ever corporate job.

Speaker 1 Lovey, lovey dovey. So I'm scratching him, giving him some love as we dive into the topic for today. All right, we are talking about one of the most important things that I believe is missing as a skill in a lot of people that I have been just coming across recently. For those of you who know more about the work I do outside of this show, I am an executive facilitator. So I've taught over 3,000 people in the past couple of years 50 different topics, everything from coaching and listening skills to uh how to give feedback and how to delegate effectively, how to overcome communication challenges and

Speaker 1 deal with times of uncertainty, uh, mindfulness practices, so many topics. And a consistent thing that I keep telling my classes because I truly believe it, it is a life mantra of mine is direct is kind. Trying to be nice is not nice. Trying to be nice and sugarcoating things, or just not telling people how you really feel, or what they really probably need to know to improve as a professional or as a friend. How is that nice? And it's often hard for people to be direct. Now, for people like me, it's actually not hard. I am a very direct person. This has come more naturally, and

Speaker 1 in general, I'd say it had a wonderful impact in some ways. At work, this allowed me to speak clearly uh and effectively and achieve some success as a salesperson, as a team member. And it definitely alienated some people. I find that often when you are too direct with those who are not, uh, people can take it personally. Directness is often kind of associated with being aggressive or intense, which I've often been described as. And you know what? I've realized in the last couple of years that I really more than ever believe direct is kind. But what does it really mean to be direct? And also direct

Speaker 1 doesn't have to mean you're an asshole. Like, let's just own that. Direct, I think, has this association of like aggression, but I really think direct is kind. I don't think there's anything kinder than caring enough about a person, professionally or personally, to go to them and say, hey, I have some things I'd really like to share with you, honestly and vulnerably, because I care about you. I care about our relationship, I care about our team, our work. May I do so is now a good time. I think that is the kindest thing you can do. I think it is a sign that you are a leader,

Speaker 1 a confident person who actually believes that you deserve to share what's true for you, and we gotta do so in a way that can land. Hence why this is related to masterful listening. So, welcome back. Today we're talking about the power and the kindness of being direct. And I really hope those of you out there who struggle with this and who are trying really nice to be kind and not hurt people's feelings realize, and I'm not judging, I am lovingly saying this and directly saying this. You might be doing the opposite. In my life recently, I have realized the people close to me who cannot be

Speaker 1 direct with me. Um, I don't think I can have those relationships anymore. They cause a lot of frustration. They also have really depleted trust. Because if I can't trust that you can just speak to me, honestly, then I don't trust you. I don't know what you're really feeling. I don't know if what you're saying is the truth. And what I've been asking myself is am I creating a safe enough space where someone can actually feel psychologically safe with me as a business colleague, as a friend, because I want to do that. I want to own my part in can I help those that aren't as direct

Speaker 1 be more direct? And can I keep being as direct as feels right to me? And the answer is yes, and I will. And at the end of the day, I gotta say the more you grow, the more you evolve, the more you change and become stronger, it's gonna piss people off. Do it anyway. The right people in our life want to be challenged respectfully, want to grow, and want to see you grow. So if your confidence, your directness is not landing well, I want you to look inward at what you would. I want you to look inward at what you can do, and I want you

Speaker 1 to consider that some of it is the other person's work, right? Like people who have people pleasing tendencies and just can't speak up for themselves, I would look at them more with a compassionate view. I've been trying versus like, oh, just say the thing. It's actually a lot harder than I thought. So I'm gonna tell a story today. This is a super big story in my life. Um, and it has to do with being direct, it has to do with so many things that if you've listened to the show, you know we've talked about. Uh, standing up for yourself at work, building culture, uh, having great

Speaker 1 relationships, inspiring teams, just in general communication and inspiration. But before we dive into the story, I am gonna invite you to listen in a certain way because of course we are at the world's first super rad listening school. And again, welcome back. Or welcome if this is your first foray into masterful listening. So I'm gonna invite you to masterfully listen again, and I'm gonna keep saying that every time. I think this is episode 40. That's pretty cool. Um, we need to hear something a lot, a lot, a lot. 17 times, I believe, last research I saw to actually remember it. And we got to keep practicing

Speaker 1 because apparently I've heard recently, again, that I'm not a good listener, which is pretty horrible to hear, considering I'm 40 episodes into a show about listening. But guess what? Why do you think I'm talking so much about it? Because I know I need to grow in this. I know I even need to grow in being more direct about how I'm really feeling when I'm sad. That's tough for me. Professionally, I can do it. Personally, it's harder. So wherever you are, I invite you to first of all be here. Take a breath, get present, make sure you're in a space where you can listen. Masterful listening starts

Speaker 1 with a genuine curiosity and commitment to be as present as you can be and try to not have distractions around you. Try to listen to this when it's a good time, when you can focus. If you get distracted, come back. Bring yourself back. If you notice your mind wandering, it's gonna happen. Just come back. No judgment, come back. This is a practice, this is a mindfulness practice, this is a listening practice. This will only ever hurt you. You cannot overpractice listening. Seriously, I think that we cannot overdose on gratitude and we cannot overdose on masterful listening. The more I practice, the more I realize I have

Speaker 1 more room to grow. But the better I am getting. I see it and I'm acknowledging it, and I'm acknowledging that in you. So if you've been listening, thank you for doing something so kind and good for yourself and for the people in your life. Uh, aside from just the distraction and being present, make sure you really care about this topic. If directness is something you've really wanted to work on, awesome. I think this will be perfect for you. If directness is something that has gotten you in trouble, also for you, because I'm in that boat and I want to keep being direct, but I want to

Speaker 1 make sure it's received well. And I can control that to some degree, right? We can only control what we can control, then we gotta kind of accept the rest. Let's try to be a bit more stoic if we can in that way. It's just I mean, it's more peaceful. And uh yeah, just let go of everything else. I'm sure you have things happening in your life, but for the next however many minutes, I invite you to tune in to what it means to be direct and kind. Because I really do think it's the same thing. Stop trying to be nice. Be kind, be direct, be honest,

Speaker 1 clear, clarity is kind too. When we leave people confused, that is so not kind. It's a horrible feeling. So, how do we be more clear? How do we more be more direct? How do we be more vulnerable? It's connected to that as well. So we're going to explore this concept of direct is kind as an approach, especially in the context of masterful listening, right? We're gonna look into the idea that some of us uh struggle with being direct also due to this misconception that like it's mean or it's aggressive or it's intense. What if it's like the kindest thing you could do that could impact your

Speaker 1 relationships, right? It is actually one of I think the kindest approaches you can have because it fosters clarity. Again, honesty. I really think that the kindest thing you could do is be direct, clear, and honest with people. And if that turns them away, consider personally do you want people in your life who cannot hear your truth? And at work, do you want employees, for example, who also cannot handle some direct and honest feedback? If you're really coming into that conversation with a good intention, watching your tone, being respectful, and someone consistently cannot take that, I would not have someone like that working for me. Period. It

Speaker 1 is an important skill to be able to listen to direct and honest feedback. But how are we communicating? Right. That's why listening is so fascinating because I keep seeing this happening. I am saying something to someone and they are literally hearing something completely different. That's why I reflect back. Hold on, let me make sure I'm hearing what you're saying, because we can say something like, hey, I'm a bit frustrated that you didn't show up to the meeting you said you'd come to. And the person hears, God, I just feel like you're saying I'm just so bad at my job and I'm always disappointing you. Uh, that

Speaker 1 is not what I'm saying, but that is what you're hearing, right? So how are we speaking? Are we making a lot of generalizations? And are we speaking when we're really pissed off or when we've had a few moments to calm down? Right? So there's a lot to this in our personal relationships. How often are we passive aggressive? And how often does that lead to misunderstandings instead of just going to someone and saying, hey, you know what? I'm really hurt that you excluded me from when you you hosted a little dinner to like, oh, you know, I'm fine, it's not a big deal. Oh my God. I

Speaker 1 mean, I've been there too. It can be hard to just say how you feel, but this causes destruction in friendships. I've seen it, I've been on both sides of it. It sucks. So cultivating trust is so essential for relationships. And remember, the reason often people don't respond well to directness is it may trigger their own insecurities. Like if you're speaking something that someone's already a bit insecure about, it is gonna hurt. It's like you're pushing a button that you might have even installed, right? And so often we just back off. Well, what's the point of saying it? They might not react well and I don't want

Speaker 1 to hurt them. I think it is so much more hurtful to just give up on someone and not even try. So every chance you have to practice being direct will deeply enhance your life. And I want you to ask yourself, what kind of people do you want in your life? Do you want people who are trying to be nice? And so you don't really trust them because you're not sure if they're just trying to be nice or like what do they really mean? I don't, I don't want it anymore. It's caused me so much stress. I don't like working with people like that. I don't feel

Speaker 1 safe there, and I don't like having personal relationships with people like that because again, I don't feel safe. I want to know that if I can, or when I have something to say and I do so in a way where I ask for permission, hey, I'd like to share something with you. I always say that's a good idea, that I can come and you can hear it. I need people in my life, professionally and personally, maybe you feel this too, who can handle some criticism sometimes. Right? Like it feels crabby if someone's like, wow, this thing you did really frustrates me or I'm really disappointed. That

Speaker 1 doesn't feel good. I really don't like that. And yet conflict ultimately fosters respect and trust if you lean into it. So are you leaning in to the conflicts in your life? Because that is actually a way to love people deeply. It is a way to work with people. It is incredible what happens when there's a conflict and you lean in with someone and you partner through that. How much can grow? Wow. Seriously. So again, this episode, I really want to emphasize practice directness, both professionally and personally. It will improve communication, relationships, overall mental wealth, mental health, emotional health, love. When we embrace directness as a kind

Speaker 1 approach, this is what's gonna foster all of that that we all want deeper bonds, deeper collaboration. We're gonna achieve things and feel better along the way. Oh my goodness, how great is that, right? Okay. So I'm gonna um I'm gonna. Share a quick story. And this is more an example of when I had to be direct. But I could have probably done it a little better assessing it now. But what happened? And there's a lot more to this story than just this piece, so many lessons, but I'm just going to focus on this piece. So again, as I start, just listen fully. Masterful listening again. Listen

Speaker 1 to my words. Listen to my tone. Notice if I don't say something that you might be curious about. Notice if you have a certain feeling coming up, because it triggers something in you. Because it might come back. Try not to go off on a tangent in your mind. And if you have, just bring yourself back. And here we go. So at the beginning of my career, I worked at a company that I will not name, but it was a very large, at the time, it was the largest private translation company in the world. And I was really excited to work there because at the time when

Speaker 1 I had just graduated college, my goal was to just get abroad. I wanted to find a way to live abroad. And this company had 50 offices all over the world. So I was like, okay, cool. I'm going to start. I was in Washington, DC at the time. And then I'm going to be great and I'm going to get promoted. And somehow I am going to work abroad. Which I did, by the way. I actually opened up their Sydney, Australia office, or I ran it for about a month after whoever was there kind of quit. There, the way that they did it was when they would go

Speaker 1 to a new territory, they'd send one person to do all the biz dev. And then once they drummed up enough business, they'd hire more people. And that person quit. So I got to do that. And I was 21 years old, by the way, and I had only been at the company for four months. But I heard about an opportunity. I was at a happy hour. I remember on the roof of my building, and our VP of sales, you know, very successful, kind of tall, direct guy. Um, I really liked him. He liked me because I think we had a similar energy. And I was also really

Speaker 1 good at my job. Like I kind of hit the ground running, and I overheard him saying to someone, Oh, you know, yeah, this and this person left. Sydney, I need to send someone. And I literally went up to him very directly and I said, Hey, I overheard you mentioning Sydney. I'd like to go. What do I got to do to get sent? And I remember at the time he looked at me kind of like, Really? You've been here for like three months. And I'm like, Well, I don't know if that's a fair way to judge who should go. Why don't you give me a few goals?

Speaker 1 And if I achieve them, like fair game. So he did. He gave me five goals and I achieved them, and I got sent to Sydney by myself to run this office. That was a whole other story where I realized I don't think I was going to be happy at that company just because the stress and the just the intensity of like working 14 hours a day, it did not suit me. But it was really cool how that direct request got me to do something. I can't believe I did that in a way. I'm like, wow, what a badass thing to do so early in your career.

Speaker 1 And um he was a very direct person, but I'd say more on the aggressive side. And here was an example of what happened one day, which ultimately was one of the reasons I quit that job right before I was about to move to London to become the youngest director in the history of the company, uh, and be in charge of London, Paris, Berlin. Those were like the territories I was gonna have. And by the way, if somebody a year and a half prior to that, which is where when I started that job, would have told me that that's what I was gonna do, I would have

Speaker 1 been like, oh yes, like that's my dream. And I quit. Why? Because I didn't trust him or the leadership at the time, which was a horrible feeling. And here's why. One day I remember, and this was like the end of the day, maybe about four o'clock. I don't remember exactly. This was a long time ago. So this person, our VP, sends a communication. He didn't even do it live. That was interesting. He sends a communication with, hey, we're launching this new tool. It was a some sort of technology. And at the time, uh most of the translation, if I think all of it actually, was done

Speaker 1 like by human beings. We had like this three-step process. It was very thorough. We were very, we were like the high-end translation company. But you know, if you think about it, we were my specialty was I was working with like life sciences. So I was getting clients that were translating like informed consent forms for clinical trials. You want to get that accurate, right? Or even like ads. There, there were some famous snafu where someone translated something where it was super inappropriate because of the territory or language, right? And so again, um, we had some technology that was meant to be another thing we kind of upsold.

Speaker 1 And he sends us a message at about 4 p.m. saying, hey, you gotta get a demo of this tool by tomorrow morning. Anyone who does not get a demo of this tool by tomorrow morning, I'm taking away your chair. And until you get a demo, you will stand. You will not have a chair. It almost sounded a little bit like a joke, and yet I'm like, no, I don't think he's kidding. And he didn't do it live in some inspiring way, although there is no way that is inspiring, and that is me being super direct. I do not think that is appropriate. But that's what it

Speaker 1 was. And I think people didn't really know how to take it seriously because I mean it was the end of the day, it was a brand new technology. We hadn't even had like a training on it, but that was just like that was kind of the culture here. Sink or swim, do it. And if you don't do it, you got a punishment. It wasn't even like if you do it, you get this thing. So by the way, for all the leaders out there listening managers, if you are trying to motivate teams by putting a completely stringent deadline to do something that you haven't set them up

Speaker 1 for success for, and then providing a punishment, but no inspiration, please look at that. It is not effective. You know why? Let me tell you why. So obviously, no one did it. It was the end of the day. I come in the next day and I'm thinking, okay, this he's not really gonna take away people's chairs. Uh, but I walk into the office and everybody is standing and they are pissed. Uh rightfully so. And I just cannot believe it. And I am like fuming. Now, this was a sales office. There were probably, I don't know, I don't remember, eight of us. And then there was a

Speaker 1 regional director who was kind of like one under him, and then the VP of sales for the whole company, which was headquartered in New York, but he happened to be in DC. Now he did not come into work that day, but he had the person who was my boss, the regional director, take away everyone's chairs. So, first of all, he put it on her, which is real crappy. I'm sure she did not want to do that, but she had to do it because she was given instructions by her boss. And she chose not to say no and be direct about that, and that is her choice.

Speaker 1 Also, she had her chair, which I thought was interesting because we were not all in the same boat, just the salespeople were. Even though she technically was a salesperson as well, she was just a sales manager. So imagine you come in, your chair's gone, and you have to now work without a chair. I had a contract on my desk that I needed to close because it was my priority. You know, I whenever I reflect back on this story, I do not remember if it was a hundred thousand dollar deal, which was a large deal at the time, or it might have been a million-dollar deal. I'm

Speaker 1 pretty sure it was a hundred thousand dollar deal. But I remember at the time it was a big deal that I'd been working on. So before I focused on a demo for some technology that I didn't understand anything about, I was gonna close my deal. So what did I do? I took all that anger and I tried to fuel it into just finishing that because oh, I knew I was gonna say something to him. And again, he didn't come into the office, so I was gonna have to do it virtually. But I focused enough, I moved my computer setup. It was like a big screen at

Speaker 1 that point. I literally moved everything down to the floor and I sat there uncomfortable with my back hurting, closing this freaking deal. And I did it. I sent it off. And then I wrote an email, and I wish I could find it. I might have it somewhere, but it said something like, Dear boss, uh, I'm imagining that the reason you decided to take away our chairs if we didn't do this thing you asked us to do is because you thought it would somehow be motivating. However, I want to tell you that it feels like I am being treated like a child, like in kindergarten and punished.

Speaker 1 And that is probably the most demotivating and disrespectful thing that you could do. I'm bringing this to your attention because everybody is standing pissed off, and no one has actually done what you, I think, probably genuinely wanted us to do because we were not set up for success. I needed to say this to you because this is absolutely inappropriate. And I would love to help you find some ways to actually motivate us because I do think there are ways. So let's have a conversation and I'll be more than happy to share some ideas with you. Sincerely or respectfully, Svatlana, and I CC'd my boss, the woman

Speaker 1 in the office, in her chair, who could feel and see what was going on. Uh, probably 20 minutes later, she calls me into the office. And I mean, we had a great relationship too. She was super direct with me, by the way. That's why I took that job. She basically said to me, Hey, Svet, in the interview, she's like, I don't care how you do what you do as long as you do it well. And I'm like, Great, love that. And she trained me really well. Again, she was such an incredible boss to have. So shout out to you if you ever hear this. I'm not

Speaker 1 saying any names, but you know who you are. You really taught me a lot early in my career as my first boss. Um, she says, Oh, I don't, why did you, why did you do that? That was not a good idea. He is pissed. He wants to talk to you. And I'm like, Great, let's talk. Because I'm like fired up here. I mean, I'm really like, who does that? Funny though, once I was interviewing a little side note on Wall Street, like early in my career, I was just doing sales. I was really good. I could talk to people, I cared, I was passionate. And I

Speaker 1 walked into this Wall Street sales interview, I don't remember what it was for, and everybody was standing. And this was after I left that company, and I looked around and I was like, yeah, I'm probably not gonna work here. Maybe if I tell this story about how I'm looking for a healthy culture, because once my VP took away my chair to a company where no one even had chairs, they were just standing up, you know, all hyped up. I just thought that was really funny. Because again, maybe you're the kind of person that you really like that, like, I'm gonna punish you. I don't. So I

Speaker 1 think most people don't. It just wasn't motivating. No one had booked a demo. They were uncomfortable, they felt mistreated. You want to make money, treat people well. There's like research that shows now that building trust is a massive economic booster. Like, look it up. I don't have the study right now, but someone mentioned it yesterday in a class who was very smart, who I trusted. And I thought, hmm, I'm gonna look more into that. So anyway, he

Speaker 1 you know, wow, it's funny. I'm I I don't want to say what didn't happen. I know we met in person in the office. Oh, he wrote back, yes, he wrote back something like, Who do you think you are to talk to me in this way? Like he was pissed off because you know, when you come at a bully strongly, they don't like it. But he did say, When I'm back in the office, I want to talk to you. And I'm like, Great. He came back to the office a few days later, and again, dude didn't even show up. Had he come in and said, All right,

Speaker 1 I'm here, let's do this together. Just like it wasn't motivating, and no one said anything. And this is truly my superpower, but also the thing that's got me in trouble. I will say the thing. I just can't not say the thing. If I feel all this frustration and energy in a space and it's horrible, I have to acknowledge it. And someone does, and it's usually me, which is why, again, I think people like me, we need us. We also need people who know how to be quiet sometimes. But you gotta say something. It is kind. I was thinking of the other people in the office as

Speaker 1 well. It wasn't just about me. I closed my deal, and by the way, I did get a demo, but I got my chair back because it is actually not healthy to not have a safe and comfortable uh chair to sit in. Okay. Uh it's a hygiene factor. I teach a class about hygiene factors and motivation factors. It's based on Hertzberg researcher back in, I think, 1968, there was a big Harvard study published about like how do you motivate employees? And it starts with making sure they feel safe and comfortable, literally like in their chair. It's hard to be motivated if your back hurts. So when he

Speaker 1 came into the office, I remember the conversation went something like first of all, I was like, I'm coming in calm, collected. I know this guy's gonna get angry because I've seen him. I'm not gonna get defensive or angry. I'm gonna simply say what I believe. And I was always curious about culture and motivation. Again, I've just I've been a coach and I've been into this realm of how do you do good and feel good and inspire people my whole life. And I was like, listen, the intention for my email was not to offend you, but like what you were trying to do was not effective. It

Speaker 1 really set me up for failure. I had a massive deal to close and I had to close it sitting on my floor. How would you feel? Would that be motivating to you? I just was real. I was honest. I tried not to be too aggressive. Again, I don't remember exactly, but I remember by the end we were talking about what I was specifically gonna do because I also came in with some ideas for how we can motivate people in the office. I wasn't just trying to complain to him, oh, you suck and you did this. It was like, no, no, I think your intention was good.

Speaker 1 It just didn't work. So how do we work together to do something that will motivate people because they need it? And that's cool. And I literally remember he said something like, you know, it was really freaking frustrating to get that message, but I really respect that you did it. I left that meeting with him, and we both had more respect for each other because he did hear me out. And at this point, this guy's twice my age. He's been a successful executive for like a decade and a half. He didn't need to listen to me, but I was so direct that I made sure I was

Speaker 1 heard. And I'm sure that that trust that we built is one of the reasons I did receive that next promotion. But ultimately, the the policies of the way that company ran their teams and motivated people did not land with me. It landed with a lot of people. I actually see now, almost 20 years later, a lot of the people who I worked with are still there. So I'm assuming they're doing things better and right. But again, I guess some people are motivated through fear. I'm not. So that was an example of me having to be direct. And I'm so glad I did because ultimately it helped

Speaker 1 the team because we found some ways. Like I started teaching Zumba in the office. I was a Zumba instructor at the time, and I'm like, let's get people moving, let's get people dancing, let's get people sweating, let's have a cool training that actually explains to us the value of this technology that you want us to sell a demo or schedule a demo for that no one understands. Like I it led to some creativity and some collaboration around what we were gonna do to actually move forward in our business. It also led to him and I connecting more and kind of respecting each other a little more,

Speaker 1 just like, okay, uh, I appreciate you spoke up, but please do so in the following way next time, right? Because you don't want to be yelling at someone. You don't want to be angry. And you know what? If it happens, just taking a deep breath and owning that, apologizing, trying again could be super, super, super powerful, right? A lot of people that I meet will probably not do what I did. Um because I did what I did, meaning in that moment with him, because I stood up for myself and I stood up for my team, and I made some suggestions for what I think could be

Speaker 1 done better. Here was the impact of that. First of all, I did often perform at a super high level. I was consistently a top sales performer, literally every single job I've ever had. Um, I've also quit every single job I've ever had, except for the last one where I got fired, which was awesome because I needed to go, because she said, I'm clipping your wings. Thank you to that manager. Um, you need to go be a coach and do this. So I needed a little kick in the butt. Um, and she was direct with me. That was great. But the reason I was successful as a

Speaker 1 salesperson and the reason that I often like negotiated my salaries and got promoted was because I spoke up for myself. I was direct in what I needed and what I wanted in my communication. In that way, it was really helpful. It also got me in trouble. I was often so direct that I was perceived as um intense and aggressive. I was given that feedback, and that's where I really started watching my tone. I mean, even listen to how I'm speaking now. I talk fast, I speak loud. I think I have that from just being like Eastern European. I notice sometimes when I listen to my mom,

Speaker 1 it almost sounds like she's screaming. And I'm like, can you stop screaming? And then I'm like, oh my God, I'm screaming. So that's where I had to learn. Yes, say the thing, but don't yell the thing, right? Because it could be hard enough when someone's being direct, but if they feel like they're being attacked and yelled at, that is not going to make it land, right? And consider why you're doing it. Are you really thinking of the team or the relationship or just yourself? Because I think I've gotten that feedback as well. Well, Stat, you kind of make it all about you. And the funny thing

Speaker 1 is, that wasn't my intention. I didn't think I was making it all about me, but the way I was communicating, it felt that way to other people. I was coming off so strong and direct that it kind of just like people got scared. Really, it's like so funny because I think I'm so sensitive and gentle, and I really am. Like my inner world, I'm like all water. If anyone out there knows astrology, uh, I have four planets in cancer. I'm like a sensitive little crab in a shell. But my planet of communication, which is Mercury, is Leo. So I speak like a lion. And look, I

Speaker 1 look like it, right? Like I have bright red hair. So because people hear how I speak, they assume all kinds of things about me. But they're wrong. My inner world and my outer expression are very different. And it doesn't mean I'm lying, it just is a different modality. The way I process and feel is not always how I speak things, which is why I have a podcast about listening. Because all this stuff is so convoluted and confusing, but it just takes practice, right? We resolve conflicts more effectively when we can be direct and clear. And by the way, handling conflict is way more powerful for relationship

Speaker 1 building than not having any. If I ever hear like, oh, we never have a conflict, we never fight, it's because you probably don't really care. But uh it's healthy to have some disagreements if you can navigate them respectfully, openly, directly. So keep practicing. Next time you see some sort of, you know, I don't know, injustice or something happening at work that just feels really out of integrity or really makes a bad impact, consider what would it be like to go and say something to someone or even on someone's behalf, right? Like, I don't think it's good to butt into other people's business, but if I see

Speaker 1 something that feels super wrong or hurtful, I think it's very kind to go in directly, at least get curious about what's going on, right? It's like, would people in your life speak up directly for you if they heard someone saying something poor about you and you weren't there? I wonder that, because I know I would. I would speak up for people in my life if I really felt like they were getting attacked in some way. And I wonder who would do that for me. And I hope they would. I think that sort of direct and honest care and vulnerability. And also it's like transparency, just be

Speaker 1 real with who you are. Speaking up for yourself is self-love. Speaking up for yourself means you care enough about yourself to value your feelings, your needs, your wants, and to share them. It inspires other people too. And I honestly think the reason that I've probably triggered so many people along the way is because in some way they wanted to be more like me in that way. And trust me, I don't say that from an ego place. There are some qualities that I do see that are great in me, and I am the biggest critic of myself. In that way, though, and I've heard this. Wow, you

Speaker 1 just have this ability to communicate really clearly and directly. I've heard this my whole life. I really think it's true. It was a bit of a natural talent. It has gotten me in trouble. It's also got me really far. And I think when someone is a certain way that we want to be, it can kind of make us not like them or be jealous, right? I know I felt that way when I've seen certain, for me, when I saw women like in the corporate world who were just like kind of like the girls I used to see in high school who like played soccer and were

Speaker 1 really fit and like looked like the Barbie image, I never fit in. I was like, you're probably a bitch. No, I'm just insecure, right? So it's the same thing. I think often when we want to be direct and we're more like putting our own needs aside and we're not sharing them, but when we see someone really fully self-expressed, we're kind of like maybe we get triggered by that, but just notice that. Use it as inspiration. If you like someone who's expressive because you feel like they're effective and they're impactful and it's inspiring, what would I have to do to practice that a little bit more? Is

Speaker 1 a question to ask yourself, right? First, start masterfully listening to yourself. What matters to you? What do you feel like you must speak up on? And then how do I say this in a way that it would really, really land? Because remember, try moving forward to the best of your ability when you feel this urge to like really share something, but you're like sugarcoating it, making it sound nicer, but you're not really saying the thing, or it's a little passive aggressive. Just ask, what do I really want here? Because if I just want to bitch invent, okay, that might be a good strategy. But if I

Speaker 1 want to resolve something, if I want to build trust, if I want to feel heard, if I really want to care for this person, the kindest thing I can do is be direct. So what does direct look like for you? That is a question I want to start to wrap up with and leave you with. That is your homework to ask yourself, what does direct look like for me? What does direct and kind look like for me? And how can I even remember the mantra, direct as kind? I, for the longest time, just had it written up on my mirror. Or just look at it. Because

Speaker 1 often people, again, when I was direct, did not think I was kind. And I was like, no, no, but it is. It's something else. It's about how I'm doing it. Or I might just have people who can't handle, you can't handle the truth. Um, but I think it's really important to surround ourselves with people who want to know our truth, but are we doing it masterfully? Are we doing it kindly? And if you've messed up, you could, you could change it, you can fix it. I think a lot of people have a story about me that's five years old. I'm struggling with that, honestly, personally, because

Speaker 1 I do think I was more selfish, I think I was a bit more ego-driven, and I do think I made things more about me. I'm different now. But once people have a story about you, as you're aggressive or you're intense, anything you do that feeds that story, they will see it. You know, we're looking for evidence. So if you're someone who's been so direct that it's caused problems, consider what it would look like to soften up and even share your intention. Hey, I really want to keep being direct because I believe in it, but I really want to do so in a way that would land

Speaker 1 better with you because I care about you. What do you need for that to happen? How can I communicate in a way where I can still be direct with you, but like you just know that it's coming from a good place and you know, whatever you got to do, design things with people. At work, it's the same thing. Before you give feedback, first of all, I always say, ask for permission. Hey, I'd like to share a few things with you, honestly, that I think might really help you. Because I know you care about your success. I care about your success. Is now a good time. And

Speaker 1 if they say yes, great. If they say no, get curious. All right, when would be a good time? Might just be a bad time, and that's okay. Timing matters. So ask yourself what your version of directness looks like. For me, it means that I feel like I can be me, meaning I can actually say how I feel and I feel safe, meaning I do need to have some level of trust with someone and with someone new, that's there. I'm not like a I don't trust you until I do. I'm more I trust you until I don't kind of person. So if I meet a new person,

Speaker 1 I'm just gonna speak in a way that I find the most effective, which is as clear, as slow, as um detailed, as respectful, but like I'm just gonna say the thing. And I find that usually people really do appreciate it, even if it's the hard thing. Often when I've just said the thing, people are like, oh, I kind of knew that. I was, I wanted to know. Right? It just like it's kind. It saves you time. You're just not gonna have to waste so much energy thinking about, oh my God, did they get it? Was I clear? Uh, and then the other person isn't like, what

Speaker 1 were they really trying to say? Do I even know them? Save yourself time. Also ask for feedback. Ask how things are landing. Don't assume something's landing poorly or not. Sometimes I'm sharing something directly, and on the other line, someone's really quiet and they're processing. And I used to think it means it really didn't land. And it's like, oh, it totally landed. They're just like sitting with it. So check in. How is this landing? Remember that being direct shows you do respect others and you want to understand their needs, right? Like, why are you even taking the time to practice this and do it? I hope it's

Speaker 1 because you do want to make a positive impact. If you're trying to be direct to just be an asshole, you're probably not listening to this anymore right now, right? I'm talking to the people who want to be more direct because they know it will help them, but it's hard. And I get it. Again, it's still hard for me sometimes emotionally with more personal stuff. So whether this is an issue personally or professionally, it applies to both. And notice like if you trying to be direct and honest consistently leads to negative outcomes, it's really important to know your deal breakers of when to walk away from people.

Speaker 1 For me, I got it recently. Truly, if someone in my life doesn't feel safe enough with me after I've legitimately made an effort to have direct conversations, be direct with me, and hear me, I don't want them in my life. I just don't. I'd rather have fewer people who accept and appreciate that this is coming from a good place and that I'm working on it. Right. Um professionally the same. I would not hire someone who could not handle direct feedback. And I would do everything I could to invest in building trust because the more people trust you, this does get easier. So also be patient, give

Speaker 1 people time. We all have different skills. Just like I am stronger in being direct, I have a really good friend who's just so patient and I want to be more patient. That is not a virtue I have had as much, but I'm working on it. And I appreciate when people are patient with me with my impatience. You know what I mean? Yeah, we all have room to grow. So creating a safe environment where people feel comfortable being direct with us is also really important. So if you know you have to have a really direct conversation, that might be challenging. Where can you do it? Can you

Speaker 1 do it in a safe space, in a beautiful place? Can you go in nature, right? Consider your environment. Also remember, ask questions directly as well. Show appreciation when someone who hasn't been as direct is, acknowledge them. They'll wanna won't, they'll wanna do it more. Show appreciation when someone receives something you've said really directly in a good way, right? Like a better way than before. The more we honor the good stuff and how people are growing, the more they want to grow. And again, keep emphasizing why you want to share something vulnerable, transparent, direct. When people know your intentions, and when you know your intentions and you

Speaker 1 know they're pure and you know they're good, you got nothing to lose. Because if you come in to a conversation and you know you've checked yourself, your intentions are good, you're watching your tone and you're being direct for the sake of connection, growth, love, then you've done everything you could. At that point, if you're asking questions, if you're masterfully listening and it still goes really poorly, A, there's something there you might be missing. That's a great question to ask. What am I missing? And B, it might have nothing else to do with you. All of us who are on this personal development journey, and this is

Speaker 1 a big thing I want to end with, we get really hard on ourselves. I've been super hard on myself. I've been feeling so confused about just relationships in my life and why I wasn't landing or why this wasn't working. And by the way, so many things are working that I'm so grateful for that. But you know, we always notice the stuff that's not so good. And then recently I had an experience with someone who's also very direct and very similar to me, who's having similar issues in other ways. And I thought, you know what though? I'm so proud that this is who I am. Because in

Speaker 1 some ways, really living this mantra of direct is kind, is one of the things that I know my best friend just said she really appreciates about me. She says, if there's one thing I know about Svet, is that if you come to her and you just tell her directly how you feel or what you need, she will always listen. She will do what she can to give you what you need. And I also know that that's true about me because I just value it so much. So to anyone I've hurt by being direct, don't take it personally. That's just me thinking I'm doing the right thing,

Speaker 1 and I'm working on it. And to anyone who's hurt me, because you couldn't be, I'm working on the forgiveness. But yeah, no, I forgive you. It's just, I can't have that in my life. It's unsafe. It doesn't feel good. And sometimes the people who used to be our friends or the people who used to be our colleagues are no longer aligned, right? But before you throw people away and make rash decisions, just consider expanding your range. Maybe be a bit more direct. Maybe shift how you're having conversations, maybe design them better. Maybe just ask someone what they need so that they feel more clear and safe

Speaker 1 and trusting. There's nothing more powerful than asking a great, genuine question in the most direct and clear way possible, and being honest and transparent and vulnerable, and it sounds so simple, and it is, but it's just not easy. But you can do hard things. Direct is kind. So stop trying to be nice because it's not nice, but be real. Be real. It's good to be real. Yeah? Alright, I'm gonna go be real, hang out with Rad, and keep practicing what I'm preaching, because I'm really, really making an honest effort. May we all be masterful listeners a little bit more every day, one little step at a

Speaker 1 time.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 1 See ya next time.